Honda Civic In Car Entertainment

Thanks Arun,

Alpine 9887 = 19000 + 1500 (imprint) + 8000 (bluetooth kit) = 28,500/- That's a lot of money for a non-enthusiast. Right now, he doesn't even know what make model equipments are going in his car. If I suggest him, he will go for it but I personally don't see a point. Same is the case with P-80RS. It's probably a little too technical for him. In nutshell, he is a person who uses point-and-shoot camera, not an SLR. We'll get something of this sort for my car instead and will do lots of keeda with it.

Bi-amp? You mean to say that each front component will get two channels of the amp? What's the advantage of it? I mean why would we do that? How much power these components need anyway? I am clueless actually. And is this bi-amp thing needed only for Pioneer HU? If we go ahead with 103BT, we don't need to bi-amp the comps?

I really like your idea of auditioning different components. Fit everything but components and then try different components. Lovely. Thank you.

Ok. The reason I suggested the pio is because I run the rs version and I could set it for him to within 95% accuracy. I'd have to hear it to do the bal 5%. Like you said the final 5% would'nt matter so much. Will make you a total keeda once you get this hu for your car.

Bi-amping is giving each driver (a pair of comps has 4 drivers. Two mids and 2 tweets) an independent amp ch. This has a couple of benefits. You can bi-amp with any hu.

First, it gives each driver more power and lets each driver play closer to its dynamic range. Eg if you have a 4x80watt amp and you connect the two comps to the front 2ch's each comp would get 80 watts. This means the 2drivers share this 80 watts. So the mid would get like60% and the tweet 40% i.e. 50watts/30watts. If its a 100watts rms comp, each driver is rated for 100watts. Hence the mid would be getting about 50% and the tweet30-40% of rated power. Now if you bi-amp and give each driver 80 watts they are playing much closer to their rated power. Hence more dynamic.

The second big advantage is that it allows you to listen to and fine tune each driver seperately. This is total keeda territory. While bi-amping you would connect the tweets to the front amp ch's and the mids to the rear ch's.

In bi-amped mode, if you remove the xovers from the signal path and set the network at the hu, you would be active. With passive xovers the signal is split between the tweet and the mid at a fixed frequency. Eg with the momo its at 2.6kh. Everything below 2.6khz is sent to mid and everything above to the tweet. In active mode you can select this xover point. generally crossing higher gives greater clarity. Eg in my active network the mids and tweets are crossed at 5khz. Since a range of frequencies is pinched down round the xover point, this causes some distortion (IMD). Generally there is less 'sound' at 5khz than at 2.6khz, hence lesser distortion and the music is cleaner.

Posted by Banwari Lal Sharma
I really like your idea of auditioning different components. Fit everything but components and then try different components. Lovely. Thank you.

No probs. When you audition the momo's, the xover has a tweeter attenuation switch. Set this at -6.

Good Luck.

Post edited to separate quote.

Beautiful clarification, Arun. Whatever you described, went directly inside. Thank you very very much,

Need one clarification. If we take one example, Polk MM6501 is 90W. Now this 90W is for mid and high combined or 90W each? I mean if I get a 360W amp and bi-amp the two components, all four parts i.e. two mids and two tweeters will get 90W each. If they are supposed to handle 45W each and we power them with 90W each, won't it damage them?

If I am lucky enough to audition Polk Momo's, I will definitely ask the person to do the needful.

It also means that a higher power amp can avoid bi-amping? But I believer higher power amplifiers must be insanely costly and maybe buying two amps is more VFM?

@Ban: Is the bluetooth that important for your friend?

Also I would suggest a 10'' sub atleast.

It not always that higher powered amp is costly. Cleaner amp is more costly.

The polk mm6501 are rated at 125watts rms. That means each driver can handle 125watts. So you can give the set 100watts or each driver 100watts (bi-amp). Both situations would be fine. You cannot, however hook it upto an amp that is say rated for 4x200watts.

Ami is right. Amps that make cleaner watts are more expensive. So you could have an amp that makes 4x50 watts and that may be 4times more expensive than another brand that does 4x100watts.

Of course quality matters. But when I said higher power amp means I am comparing amps from same stable. For example, I believe Polk PA 500.4 would be more expensive than PA 200.4?

@Arun, So you mean, we can't/shouldn't use a 4x200W amp to power a 100W component? Not even in normal mode? What exactly is the thumbrule (if any)? Do we need to match the power of amplifier and the driver? Or should amplifier power should be less than driver is rated at?

@Ami, no bluetooth is not that important. I am going to audition 103 and 9887 both and will decide based upon the difference in SQ.

I asked the guy for 10" woofer but he said, trust me, keep it 8". If you don't like it, I will replace right away.

Let's see how it goes.

If bluetooth ain't that important then 9887 would be my suggestion or a p80. When you audition, ensure that it should be properly tuned.

Guys, the Civic job was done successfully yesterday and the result is quite pleasing. Thank you all for the useful suggestions. Special thanks to Dhawan saab.

We were supposed to send the car to FM Drive on Friday around noon but we immediately got a long meeting and a very important commitment in the evening. Called Pankaj asked him to postpone it to Saturday morning. We reached his show at around 9:30, he came at 10, we started discussing the various components. At 11am, they got cracking. Three men of Pankaj worked continuously for nine hours before they handed over the car to Pankaj for tuning. An investment of 30 man-hours gone into the installation and configuration and it was worth! It was ages since I or my friend had more than enough time to kill and we were doing nothing but yawning, chatting, having teas/coffees and a Disprin at the end of the day. Lol.

The final setup is like this:

1. HU: Alpine 9887. Three 4v pre-outs, a hell lot of controls to be understood. Rs.19,000. W/o b&w.
2. Amplifier: Eclipse EA4100. 4-channel, 4x75W. Rs.17,000. With b&w. Was offered Alpine MRP-F300 4x50W by Pankaj but Dhawan saab's suggestion and Pankaj's self-realization made him switch to Eclipse EA4100.
3. Front stage components: Morel Tempo 6x: 80W. Rs. 11,500. Not sure about b&w.
4. Subwoofer: Polk Audio db840: 8", 180W. Rs.3,500. With b&w.
5. Civic double-din HU panel: Rs.5,000.
6. Front door dampening: Rs.4,800.
7. Ground Zero cables (so much thick that they can light up a whole colony!): Rs.4,500
8. Installation charges: Rs.2,000.

Total discount on the entire package: Rs.1,400. Total money well spent: Rs.67,000.

The overall setup sounds very natural. It's distortion free until 26-27 level of 9887 (total 35), after that distortion is noticeable. But the person in question is never going to go beyond that sound level hence no issues at all. Bass is strong and mid-bass is just amazing. Highs are soft and clear as required. No annoyance of any sort at any audible sound level.

I still have hangover of idleness of yesterday. Photos will follow, expect by tomorrow evening.

@  Banwari : The overall setup sounds very natural. It's distortion free until 26-27 level of 9887 (total 35), after that distortion is noticeable.

Where are the gains on the amp set? I assume the setup is in passive mode. Did you get a chance to do a/b?